I wouldn’t worry about this too much. He’ll stop bothering you if you seem uninteresting enough, so just give him minimal uninteresting answers. If he continues to bug you, that could potentially constitute workplace harrassment. If it gets to that point, warn him once. If he still persists after that, talk to your superior. Simple.

Lucca, from the 1995 SNES JRPG, Chrono Trigger.

No apology is necessary, though I appreciate the sentiment. It’s sadly just the way internet discourse goes most of the time.

I generally agree with your last post here, and I’m starting to think our disagreement is closer to one of semantics than a fundamental one.

I’m a bit optimistic at least that the era of the debate bros is probably closer to it’s end than it’s beginning or zenith. So hopefully that offers some solace to your concerns.

The question is how do we all offer the next generation a better model for how to engage in discourse, for which I’m open to suggestions, as I’ll admit I’m a bit at a loss on that one, but I don’t think we can ever go back to the debate styles of the past.

Regardless of all that, keep on the good path, fellow traveler. And I’ll see you around Lemmy.

And I think we can bring this back to cultish behavior as per the OP’s shower thought. Regardless of how one feels about Hasan’s treatment of his dog, its hard to navigate who is coming to this argument in good faith around animal abuse, and who are angry with Hasan for unrelated reasons and simply want to tear him down due to numerous other unrelated grievances (i.e.. blind faith in a leader and blind condemnation of any criticism of said leader).

If Hasan was a virtual nobody in terms of fame and had posted the same video, I doubt it would have received as much scrutiny or ire, and thusly the perception around those who still came to discuss the video would be that of people talking in good faith (and not just trying to smear someone’s reputation).

I will admit I am increasingly frustrated that cult mentality creates a sort of fog around these discussions, as it’s hard to tell who wants to have a genuine discussion and who just wants to tear down the reputation of someone with whom they have a grudge. And sadly this pervades many disagreements online like this one you and I have.

Neither of us can tell if one is sincere or not. And perhaps even worse, even if we both are sincere in our convictions (which I believe we are), its incredibly difficult if not impossible for us both to devote the time and effort to have a nuanced discussion on the topic, let alone change laws about it. But the positive side is that our discussion here still has the small potential to influence people’s minds on the topic, so at least there’s that.

As an aside, I am only vaguely aware of the various other dramas around Hasan.I followed his drama with Ethan Klein for a time and admittedly came out favoring Hasan’s side of the story on that one. The rest of it I only occasionally tune into.

Anyways, I think you and I have at least come to a mutually respectful disagreement, and unless you wanted to continue this discussion further, I’m content to conclude it here.

Fair enough. And I’ll at least concede its unlikely we’d come to a satisfying meeting of the minds here. Animal Abuse and what constitutes it is admittedly a somewhat complex topic that is still and probably will forever be evolving.

And it’s not like I don’t get the emotional aspect to this. I’ve had life long pets (cats, not dogs), and I hate the thought of abusing any animal. But the debate around what constitutes animal abuse ranges from people wanting to grant human rights to some/all animals all the way to poachers not giving any fucks about any animal’s well being.

This is why I do default to experts. And yeah, its some expert on the internet that I simply perceive as having put in his two cents in good faith, but I just value that opinion over so many in the debate bros space because its just an endless sea of bias in that sphere. Ironically my bias against that corner of the internet means I have a bias towards others outside of that world.

That said, I’ll still stand by my belief that an expert opinion has more value than a non expert, but that doesn’t negate your opinion that an expert’s opinion isn’t consensus and one’s individual conscience shouldn’t be considered in the discussion.

Again, all fair enough.

Look, you can find Hasan’s use of his dog as a prop for his streams distasteful. Heck, I’d agree with that sentiment.

But saying someone inflicted animal abuse is a serious accusation that has legal ramifications should it have occurred.

According to one account of a single expert which I provided, Hasan has not committed what I can only assume many in his field would be considered animal abuse.

You can question his credentials, you can question his legitimacy, you can question your own society’s definition of what constitutes animal abuse. Heck, you can even push your lawmakers to change the definition of what constitutes animal abuse.

But as it stands currently, it does not appear, from my admittedly very limited point of view, that Hasan committed animal abuse as it is currently defined in the laws surrounding it in the United States.

Look, I am even sympathetic to your argument, but when an expert in dog behavior is telling me this is acceptable forms of disciplining your dog, and I perceive that they are presenting their expertise in good faith, then I simply value their definitively expert opinion over the emotional reactions of overly hyped fans of one side or another in what I consider to be a toxic soup of debate bros accolades.

If you at least cannot see why I might think that, then I don’t know what else I can say to you other than I’m sorry that you feel that way.

EDIT: grammar, removal of double negative.

Ugh. Okay man, the expert’s opinion doesn’t matter. You win, lol.

Like I say, I’m not a fan of Hasan, as I find debate bros culture kind of distasteful, but the only way you can convince me that Hasan definitely abused his dog is to provide me with a contrary argument provided by someone who is an expert on dog training.

I’ll wait dude, seriously. Just provide me with any evidence that has a shred of credibility.

Not according to any dog trainer you’d speak to. Sorry dude, I default to experts in their fields when considering things, not just my emotional gut reaction.

But if you’re a certified dog trainer, I’d be willing to give your opinion equal consideration.

You can hate on Hasan, but at least provide someone other than Ethan Klein doing the analysis… the guy obviously has a long history of beef with Hasan and honestly it boils down to a lot of he said she said kind of argument which is not only tiresome but rife with so much bias its impossible to separate fact from fiction when it comes to either of their accounts of each other.

I don’t know, I saw a YouTube video of a dog trainer who watched the video and basically said Hasan wasn’t likely to be abusing his dog, at least based off the specific video in question.

I’m not a fan of Hasan. I agree with a lot of what he has to say in regards to political matters, but I’m just not into the drama that surrounds debate bro culture in which he is a major figure.

That said, this issue with his dog is potentially a smear campaign, and there seems to be at least some credible evidence to suggest it is.

Here is the dog trainer in question. He claims to not have any political or social affiliation with Hasan, which I take at face value, but you can ascertain for yourself whether or not to believe him.

EDIT: slight wording change.

Probably free. Depends on how hot the soup and how scary the movie.

My limit for spicy is habanero and my limit for horror is the Smile movies. After that the price goes up significantly, probably in the hundreds of dollars, with more emphasis on the spiciness of the soup, but if the movie will cause nightmares for weeks to come…yeah, that can also add up.

Interesting question OP.

Even on GrapheneOS, sure it uses a sandboxed Google Play Store, which is obviously great for users, but the developers of Android apps still have to hand over their personal data to Google specifically as this new decree from the Lords of the Google fiefdom entails.

Because FOSS developers rightly value their personal privacy, this decree effectively kills incentive for FOSS developers to continue making and maintaining apps for Android. Running GrapheneOS doesn’t circumvent this.

It’s like I’m saying “I’m hungry” and you say “Go for a run, it’s healthy for you.” I mean… it’s true that running is healthy… but the act of running doesn’t solve the problem of me being hungry…

There is no ethical consumption or production under capitalism.

But hey, at least you get to survive in a nightmare world.

Not a movie, but Andor had so many good ones. And I mean a lot, too many for a single post. My favorite though is Namek’s Manifesto:

"There will be times when the struggle seems impossible. I know this already. Alone, unsure, dwarfed by the scale of the enemy.

Remember this. Freedom is a pure idea. It occurs spontaneously and without instruction. Random acts of insurrection are occurring constantly throughout the galaxy. There are whole armies, battalions that have no idea that they’ve already enlisted in the cause.

Remember that the frontier of the Rebellion is everywhere. And even the smallest act of insurrection pushes our lines forward.

And then remember this: the Imperial need for control is so desperate because it is so unnatural. Tyranny requires constant effort. It breaks, it leaks. Authority is brittle. Oppression is the mask of fear.

Remember that. And know this, the day will come when all these skirmishes and battles, these moments of defiance, will have flooded the banks of the Empire’s authority and then there will be one too many. One single thing will break the siege.

Remember this. Try."

I really love the Voice Acting in Telltale’s The Walking Dead series. Just superb story and the actor’s really sell a superb script. One of the better stories I’ve seen in Video Games.

You can also self host your own redlib instance, tunnel it through wireguard if you don’t want to share your instance publicly, etc.

Copilot, Github, LinkedIn, ChatGPT are the ones that come to mind. All of them have started to degrade in quality in one way or another, and with the exception of LinkedIn, they all have competitors that could potentially, over the long haul, could dismantle Microsoft. They’re also running out of places to extend and extinguish.

It probably won’t happen in one or two lifetimes, but enough cracks in a dam accumulate and eventually the whole thing breaks.

Oh really, how bummed would they be?

Say, what did the American Revolutionaries do instead of protesting the King of England? Hmm…wait, why did they call themselves American Revolutionaries and not English Colony Protestors? Hmm…fucking…hmmm…

On a more serious note, tbh, it’s only a matter of time before world governments consider making no log vpns illegal. I can only imagine it pisses off law enforcement that when they show up to vacuum up the data, that they basically get a middle finger from these no logging vpn companies.

I’m very much hoping that this never happens, but I see no reason why various law enforcement agencies won’t eventually bring this to lawmakers.