Yeah I agree with that. Making people feel bad is not making them like you, try to understand you or work with you. Otherwise heaxbear would already have taken over the Lemmyverse by bullying everyone into being socialist.
Its the same logic people use to defend their bullying of fat people.
And by no means I mean to stop critiquing people. But doing so with compassion, a willingness to educate and social awareness is so much better when you want to have people join your cause.
Yeah and now you think it makes sense to do the same to others. Which yes it worked, but in a fucked up way. You now also dont seem see the problem in wielding shame and embarrassment to influence others. Those are tools you use to make people submit and not to support in growing into the people they could be.
I don’t actively do it with the intention to make people submit. I do it because I don’t care about them and being mean to them is funny and good (we are talking about people who ultimately support fascism, here)
But also I don’t dunk on people I might have any genuine independent influence on; I do try to do the ‘support them into growing into the people they could be’ thing for those folks
About a decade ago I had started down the manosphere/incel path as a very lonely individual. The only reason I stopped and kinda 180’d outta that was because the ideas I was listening to were being made fun of and insulted by most of the internet. That was the influence I needed to do some self-reflection.
Point being if you don’t insult the person but you make them think twice about the ideas they’re accepting, that can be effective.
Hmm, I guess I’m different. I know people often respond to shame in particular with defensiveness, but they should read Brené Brown and then not do that anymore /lh. Pretty sure research on guilt though shows that specific and appropriate guilt more often leads to constructive change, with embarrassment being kinda between shame and guilt.
Someone else asked a similar question to the first half of my comment. Are you open to sharing your perspective on those bits?
![[Discussion] We should stop using "liberal" as an insult.](https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/pictrs/image/0ad2ba1f-d678-4ed9-83a3-d41c3380fbb5.webp){kind=link}
That doesnt really work. All this does is push them further away from the left. Ive got a study lying somewhere, I can dig it up if you want.
Yeah I agree with that. Making people feel bad is not making them like you, try to understand you or work with you. Otherwise heaxbear would already have taken over the Lemmyverse by bullying everyone into being socialist.
Its the same logic people use to defend their bullying of fat people.
And by no means I mean to stop critiquing people. But doing so with compassion, a willingness to educate and social awareness is so much better when you want to have people join your cause.
Hexbears’ bullying absolutely worked on me lmao
Yeah and now you think it makes sense to do the same to others. Which yes it worked, but in a fucked up way. You now also dont seem see the problem in wielding shame and embarrassment to influence others. Those are tools you use to make people submit and not to support in growing into the people they could be.
I don’t actively do it with the intention to make people submit. I do it because I don’t care about them and being mean to them is funny and good (we are talking about people who ultimately support fascism, here)
But also I don’t dunk on people I might have any genuine independent influence on; I do try to do the ‘support them into growing into the people they could be’ thing for those folks
About a decade ago I had started down the manosphere/incel path as a very lonely individual. The only reason I stopped and kinda 180’d outta that was because the ideas I was listening to were being made fun of and insulted by most of the internet. That was the influence I needed to do some self-reflection.
Point being if you don’t insult the person but you make them think twice about the ideas they’re accepting, that can be effective.
Hmm, I guess I’m different. I know people often respond to shame in particular with defensiveness, but they should read Brené Brown and then not do that anymore /lh. Pretty sure research on guilt though shows that specific and appropriate guilt more often leads to constructive change, with embarrassment being kinda between shame and guilt.
Someone else asked a similar question to the first half of my comment. Are you open to sharing your perspective on those bits?